I seriously don't understand what it is with you and age. Like when we sold Silva constantly going on about how people here will bash him when he's 34 etc, etc, etc. And that you're happy we're selling him now bla bla bla

What does age have to do with anything? If he can still give his contribution to the team instead of become a liability then no one will care if he's 16 or 40. Did anyone heap anything other than parise on Nesta for example? No because he was still performing at a top level and was crucial to this team. Rino for example though, someone who I was/am a huge fan of, did turn into a liability with age, simply because he was a player that solely relied on his physical attributes rather than brains.

Kaka when I've seen him for Real is still a very good player. No not anywhere near what he used to be for us, but that has been the case from day 1 at Real. Mainly because of constant injuries, and we'd already seen a very slight decline with us in his final season because his knees had already been giving him trouble. That being said, Kaka was never just a mindless speedster. He's not a Walcott type player. He still has great technical footballing abilities that more than make up for the loss of the amazing acceleration and speed he had in his younger years.

If we were all simply pre-occupied with the age of the players the we wouldn't be happy about being linked to Beckham, we'd just be happy about allthe young names we're being linked with. But that's not the case. We all want balance. Something our management seem too incompetent to achieve

Well with age comes experience, but you never appreciated that. Kaka will be your new Seedorf

Well, that is if we sign him at all.

I/We never appreciated it?

Experiance can only do so much when your body won't cooperate anymore and for some of our older players their bodies gave in yet we still persisted on using them as if they were still in their early 20s.

Kaka becoming the new Seedorf? Seedorf had a love/hate relationship with the MAJORITY of milan fans (not just people here) because he was mostly lazy and showed up when he decided to do so (and in his last 2 seasons or so he wasn't even able to do that).

Big problem with Ricky quite simply is he was pretty poor between 2007-2009 - and even worse when he went to Spain.

If we get back pre-2008 Kaka or even half of him it's a good move.

If we're getting what he is now, it's a complete and total waste and will be as bad as the return of Sheva.

I don't think he was "poor". He was maybe out of shape, but his performances still maintained a high level.

Don't agree at all.

The current Kaká is better than 75% of the Serie A players.

Really? Poor?

He was still our leading scorer and still carried the team on his shoulders 99% of the time. If that's a poor Kaka then I'll still take him. And he wasn't even worse when he went to Spain. He still scored regularly (when playing) and makes assists at Real. I'm not saying he's been great, and yes he's never been the Kaka he was for us at Real but I think you're being overly harsh

Kaka's problems have stemmed from his injuries mostly. He's not a typical Brazilian where he achieves something then lets himself go down the road of not caring for football in general or his body ala Adriano, Ronaldo and many more. Once he started having trouble with his knees while still with us, he started to deteriorate a bit. His explosiveness was in his pace, how he stripped defenders completely.

Still even though I know you're far from his biggest fan, even this Real Kaka is still miles better from resorting to playing Boateng or even worse; Urby in the AM position.

Most importantly, getting Kaka SHOULD force us back to the 4-3-1-2 formation which has always worked for us instead of this ridiculous no-winger 4-3-3 system Allegri is playing (although with Allegri you can't rely on the logical course of action to be taken). So you can take that ONE positive from it all.

And just to be clear. I'd personally prefer Sneijder a MILLION times over Kaka, no matter how much of a sentimental factor Kaka brings to the plate. But just like our coach, Galliani & Co would never go for the more logical option

Can I get a transfer summary?

We sold Pato apparently, is what I know.

Kaka has more assists and goals per minute than Ozil at madrid. I think he's still ok, speed or no speed.

Kaká would be a good add, but not at any cost knowing our situation and his age.

His age? He's 30, I don't think it's a real problem.

It is when you sign him for 25 million euros, it is not when you sign him for 5 million, which is the idea behind the words not at any cost.

Who said anything about 25m? We'll sign him on loan with option to buy, if at all.

We were close to selling Robihno as well (in which case we would've bought a new striker) but it doesn't seem to be the case anymore.

That's your transfer summery, we just sold Pato.

Galliani: "None of our midfielders will leave because Ambrosini got injured".

De Jong out for the rest of the season, no replacement. Ambro out for a month, no replacement. This is just... Urgh!

Doubt we'd pay anything over 5-10 for Kaka. Fair deal.

Idiotic.

I really hope this means more playing time for Strasser. Let's give him a real run out see what we have in him. Unfortunately a more likely outcome is that Montolivo will be moving to the middle. If that's the case I wouldn't mind a Boateng-Monto-Nocerino midfield.

What majority? The man is a Milan legend. He offered his services before this winter transfer window to Galliani because the team was struggling.

No one said he was 20 ... Your calling for Kaka now at 31, when Seedorf was 31 you considered him finished.

Anyways, Im not arguing this ... I just don't think Kaka is an efficient player to be added, more of a player who would add experience in as many ways.

It's supposed to be a loan deal FFS. no true Milan fan in their right mind would say no to Kaka on a loan deal when we're in such deep **** unless they personally dislike Kaka.

Crazy - so out of the loop I didn't even know we'd officially sold Pato.

Jesus H Christ.

I agree and disagree with this at the same time. Remarkable.

One of these days we'll agree on something. I'm not just dismissing your entire post I just get a little weary of your 'I'm right you're wrong' approach these days.

It started when you professed Juve would NOT win the league, wouldn't keep it up. Then when they did you basically ignored it and blamed us for letting it slip away or something.

Since then you've been quite stubborn with your own opinion - you've kinda become what X-Off used to be like.

He's mellowed and admits now and again to getting it wrong and concedes - he didn't used to. I respect that a great deal. You've kinda gone in the opposite direction.

Before you ask, no I do not have a personal problem with you, you're a good soul. I just ain't sure I see any point debating with you when we disagree because you never give any ground.

I think that watching a handful of games in the San Siro clearly showed this in Seedorf's latter years at Milan. I never said that he wasn't a respectable, honourable and true professional of the game and was a great servant for this team. FAR from it. Some of the players we have disgracing this shirt make me long for the days of Seedorf. But you simply cannot close your eyes to the faults that Seedorf did have. And yes, it was a love/hate relationship. Because fans could see the lack of effort in some games, espcially when you're watching him week in week out and you can compare how in one game he barely bothers to jog while in the other he could basically decide a game pretty much on his own. That is where the love/hate relationship stemmed from in Seedorf's case.

I sais I personally do not care whether someone is 16 or 40. As long as they can give a contribution to the club I'm all for it. How old is Becks these days? I'd still love it if he came on board for a season or 2 to provide some balance in te team because of the barrage of unkowns the management will undoubtedly inflict upon us in the coming years.

I'm personally more opposed to getting Balotelli now then to getting Kaka. Because Balo would bring in trouble in an already shaky environment.

One last question. Do you agree that he a vast improvement over our current crop?


I've said twice in that very post that yes Kaka has deteriorated and lost the edge that made him great, essentially THIS IS agreeing with you!

I just don't agree with you saying that he was bad with us, even worse for Real and won't be that much of an upgrade on what we CURRENTLY have.

How is that being stubborn? Do you want me to nod along with whatever you say? I agreed on the basis of your argument, not the exxegeration. I made my points about why. How is that being stubborn exactly?

As for being wrong. I admitted to being PARTIALLY wrong on the Juve issue. But which Milan fan actually believes that we did NOT throw that title away last season aside from Allegri apologists that is? Another factor: the injuries we had. This factored big time into the grand scheme of things as well. Hindsight is always 20/20 right? Who knew things would evolve as they did last season for us. Every Milan fan acknowledges that we basically threw it away last season. Our last REAL chance at winning a title for a very long time might I add.

Being wrong in general? I admit when I am wrong. For example Max here would tell you how wrong I was on a certain Gilardino. And I have no trouble saying how wrong I was about him. About many other things in fact. I have no problem saying I'm wrong when I'm proven to being so.

What you want me to agree with you that Boateng should be played anywhere Allegri's mind wishes on that particular day? Or that it's ok for Allegri to play Urby in every position under the sun? I thought this was a discussion forum. Not a "+1" "agreed" shoutbox where someone says something and you go along with it.

As is this case. You made your oppinion on Kaka, I partially agreed with it but disagreed with the exxegeration of it. How is this stubborn or not relenting?

Also, might I add. Why should ANYONE really relent on an opinion they have? It's my opinion and not sticking to it devalues whatever I say. After all everything that we've been disussing this season is all based on personal opinions rather then seeing who is right or wrong as most of the discussions have centered around Allegri and until he's booted, no one can say whether we were right for complaining or wrong. So how am I supposed to admit to being wrong here?

What you mean this transfer window? Did this really happen?


?? What... how??

Apparently we've reached an agreement with Brescia to acquire half the rights (co-ownership) of 21-y-o Polish midfielder Bartosz Salamon. Rumors say he was closely followed by Barça and Dortmund.

Link

So, with him and Saponara we've practically signed the DM and AM of our future.

Hopefully good ones too.

Apparently Milan is interested in Nancy left-back Massadio Haïdara (MN).

I think this is why we struggle to agree. The highlighted sentence is a really big misunderstanding from you regarding what I said. I softly implied the second part but didn't even come close to the rest of it. So you base your rebuttal on not quite grasping what I said.

Maybe I do the same with you?

As for the final part: can you possibly highlight any time you've agreed with my opinion in the past 3 months

I really don't see it as a misunderstanding. You said this

"Big problem with Ricky quite simply is he was pretty poor between 2007-2009 - and even worse when he went to Spain.

If we get back pre-2008 Kaka or even half of him it's a good move.

If we're getting what he is now, it's a complete and total waste and will be as bad as the return of Sheva."

Saying it would be as bad as the return of Sheva isn't softly implying anything as we all know how REALLY bad that one turned out.

Also the bold part is basically saying that same thing I said which you highlighted in bold. You said poor, I said bad. You said even worse, I said even worse as well. I really don't think I misunderstood anything... I agreed with you initially that he had deteriorated slightly in his latter seasons with us and dropped off even more at Real. So that's where I agreed with you, but disagreed with the exxegeration of your assessment of Kaka. That's about it.

As for our differing opinions. Why should EITHER of us agree with each other when we clearly don't agree about the key points we've been discussing. Whch have basically all centered aound Allegri. I don't expect you to relent on your opinion. We debate and discuss but never try to change each other's views by shouting at each other or anything of the sort. Isn't that the entire point of a forum?

If I agree on something with you I'll be the first to say it, just like I do when I agree with someone else. You mentioned x-off, and he's a prime example of where we agree on a lot of things, but have also disagreed on a lot of others as well

God, this is proving really difficult. I meant the second part of the bit I bold highlighted in your statement was the only part I'd implied. The rest I'd not even said. You seem to take pieces of my comments, misunderstand them, then begin a new line of debate I'd not even mentioned.

That said I stand by my comment - Sheva did about as well at Chelski as Kaka has at Real. And I don't want history repeating itself.



I think you've not quite understood me again. When I called him poor, I meant by HIS standards. He became only good rather than the mercurial son of God he'd previously been. I think 'deteriorated slightly' is generous. I think he lost about 40% of what he was. I also can't agree he was carrying us alone. Mainly because we had guys like Ronaldo and Ronaldinho, the latter of whom recaptured a fair bit of his Barca form with us till it tailed away.



Problem is debate when someone disagrees with you and seems robust and stubborn with their view feels a bit pointless. It's like talking to a brick wall.

You very rarely ever back down, and that's kinda my issue. I accept your point about standing by your opinion if you hold it importantly, but I'm not totally sure I've ever really seen you back down from anything these past few months. Partial isn't really that accommodating.

As an aside, my entire conversation has been nothing to do with Allegri, why are you bringing him up repeatedly?

That's your entire comment that I quoted.

I don't know where you think the misunderstanding happened... I understood what you were trying to say which you've explained in more detail in the quoted part below. The rest of my post I only wrote about why I think he'd still be useful, which you don't think is the case and why I thought you were being a bit harsh in your assessment. I don't see how you think there was a misunderstanding...

Maybe I am going out of my mind and still can't understand you Who knows.

But here. I'll give you what you want. I'll conceed in this one. You think that Kaka won't be useful for us, while I do. I agree with you that anyone who expects anywhere near what Kaka was for us in his first spell will be soarely disappointed. And THAT is the point that we can both agree on right?


Poor by his standards? Yes, I agree with that.

But he was still crucial for us. Even when he was not at his best. You don't think we were that reliant on him... Meh, he was still usually our top scorer. Even when Ronaldo and later Ronaldinho came in.


I don't get why you're saying this, because you don't agree with me either and I don't expect you to conceed so I can feel better about what I'm saying. People debate all the time and 99% of the time those debates end in "let's agree to disagree". That means neither party is willing to give in on their points unless there is evidence that they are proven wrong.

I'm mentioning Allegri because he's centered around most arguments on here. And not just by me but the majority of the posters. So I'm choosing these areguments as a basis for what I'm saying. My point is, we'll keep seeing these discussions about him as long as he's coaching the team. And unless one party is proven to be wrong for complaining/defending him then none of us can really say whether one is right or wrong in their beliefs about this particular subject. I don't know if you get what I'm trying to say here, but for me this is the crux of the whole issue that we've been discussing

Sorry Han, can't agree with that. From my research, online and offline, this figure is around the 92% mark. But yeah, whatever. Let's just agree to disagree.

The Sun is convinced we'll sign Balotelli for £24 million.

Unless Kaká is willing to reduce his wages to €5 million, then it's not happening. C'mon Ricky, make that sacrifice!

Yeah, it depends on him, he can't have it both ways. Let's see if he really wants to come back that badly..

He did say two days ago that he's willing to do everything in order to return, so lowering his wages would be the first and foremost thing to do.

Galliani: "Only Strasser, Carmona and Valoti will leave. The various Mesbah, Traoré and Flamini will stay because we need everyone".

Source: Mediaset

OMG, OMG, OMG! Saying Strasser will leave but the other duds we have will stay because we need them is hitting the bottom low right there! Fucking ridiculous.

Classic Galliani.

What is the logic man? This is just getting ridiculous. If de Jong is injured and Ambrosini is injured, then how can Strasser be given away? How is he NOT ONE OF THE PEOPLE THAT IS NEEDED? He is a decent player with potential for more. He has held his own whenever he has stepped on the pitch... At this point I don't get what the management is trying to do. EVEN if they get a high quality DM, Strasser will still provide a very good back up!

What the hell man? It's getting harder and harder to get behind this team...

Nice one


Well The Sun is THE Holy Grail of gossip mags


Yeah, WHAT a sacrifice THAT is!

If Kaka does not compromise then we absolutely need to look elsewhere. Still for a bit more, I still say we should go after Sneijder instead of Kaka


Where's the face palm simlie when you REALLY need it

With De Jong injured for the rest of the season, Strasser leaving, Ambrosini and Muntari being question marks in terms of injuries, and us not willing to sign another DM, it becomes necessary for Monto to play as DM for the rest of the season. Play Boateng and Nocerino in center midfield, Kaká or Bojan behind the strikers, and El Sha alongside Pazzini/Niang in attack.



Anything else simply won't work.

Kaka plays for Milan? My time machine works!

And this would?